Prop i.d. please.

[Jaross]

Hiya, I have just bought this propeller from a junk/antique shop.
I already have bits and pieces of ww1 props but I think this one is later.
It is 78 inches long
The hub is 9 wide at the back
Depth of hub is 3 3/4 thick
The centre hole is 2 3/4 wide
There are 8 bolt holes and 4 smaller ones.
None of the markings or stamps can be seen as it is entirely covered in fabric and been painted.
It has copper leading edges 3/8 of an inch wide coming half way down each blade.
Any ideas ?[IMG][/IMG]

[Dave]

I'd say the possibilities are huge. It's modern design and if you look at Sensenich, for instance, you'll see that just that one manufacturer has at least 7 models of that length. Other manufacturers were similar. There are also 6 hole and 8 hole variations in those as well.

[Jaross]

I thought as much, when you say modern what are we talking here? It does seem to be quite old I reckon maybe 1930,s.
Thanks, John.

[Dave]

Generally it's 40's or later, but some are 30's. Sensenich began manufacturing props in 1932, for instance, but is still making some of the same models. There's really no good way of telling for most of them.

[Jaross]

Thanks for the reply, can you tell me why I can't find any pictures of similar props completely covered in fabric , also would it the right thing to do to strip it back to wood for display and if so how to do it?
Cheers, John.

[Dave]

I've NEVER seen a propeller completely covered in fabric, so I can't answer that. Some had blades that were covered almost all the way to the hub (like this Armstrong Whitworth FK8), but even those weren't all that common. If it's fabric you should see seams everywhere that fabric overlaps, and I would think it would difficult to cover a hub area with fabric due to the complexity of curvatures there.

The detail in the photo isn't clear enough to me to know what's going on there.

[Jaross]

I will get some more detailed photos to you . Sounds interesting
John.

[Jaross]

Here are some more photos, sorry about the size. It seems to be made out of a darker timber than the sensenich props, does this mean anything? Hopefully you can see that it is totally covered in fabric and there does not seem to be any seams.
John.

[Dave]

Are you sure it's fabric and not just paint? I can't imagine any way of applying fabric without showing evidence of seams in places.

[Jaross]

Yeah I am as sure as I can be, perhaps it was doped on to start with and there is a fair amount of paint over it which could hide joints especially butt joints, but having said that I see what you mean! The weave can clearly be seen though. I tried to show the colour of the wood, could this indicate age ?
Sorry to keep on but I don't know where else to enquire and I would love to know more.
Thanks for your time, John.

[Dave]

Well, this is all a little bit like trying to identify an old tire that has the numbers covered up. There are just way too many possibilitiies to be able to identify it.

My GUESS is that it's a British propeller for one of the many aircraft that were used as trainers. It's a left hand rotation, which eliminates most all of the common U.S. built aircraft, and mahogany was used fairly commonly in their production. It's quite possibly one of the ones on this list, but which one?

[Jaross]

That is brilliant, I can now give an educated reply when asked! I didn't realise there were so many of these type of aircraft. It gives a flavour of what it came from, it certainly looks very similar to a lot of these. Thanks, John.

[Jaross]

I know its my choice, but how wrong would it be to strip it for display?
If it is really frowned upon I wouldn't.
If so what to use and also what to use to bring the mahogany? to a good finish?
Thanks again.

[Dave]

If it were a rare artificat in original condition then you would create a huge decrease in value. Frankly, it's not worth that much in the first place. It has been multi-drilled in the hub, and the fabric MAY have been added by a previous owner, perhaps even to cover up a conspicuous defect that was repaired beneath it.

So in general, if an item like this has been previously altered, then adding other alterations has less impact on its value, and in some cases may actually increase it. The same does NOT apply for one in original condition.

[Jaross]

Yeah, thought as much.
I just tried, to get a small patch of the green paint off and underneath it the cloth is rock hard and on closer inspection appears to have been painted black all over, I think it may be too difficult to get back to wood and achieve a decent finish, Ho Hum !